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Pope debunks Christmas myths: Your take
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Members of Calmar Lutheran Church pose as a living Nativity in Calmar in December 2011. (Joyce Meyer/Freelance)
It’s Christmas, but not as you know it: a new book released this week by Pope Benedict XVI looks at the early life of Jesus — and debunks several myths about how the Nativity unfolded.
In “Jesus of Nazareth — The Infancy Narratives,” the pope says the Christian calendar is actually based on a blunder by a sixth century monk, who Benedict says was several years off in his calculation of Jesus’ birth date.
According to the pope’s research, there is also no evidence in the Gospels that the cattle and other animals traditionally pictured gathered around the manger were actually present.
He also debunks the claim that angels sang at the birth, a staple theme of Christmas carols.
The book, which is being published in multiple languages in time for Christmas, is the third in a series by the pontiff. The previous two volumes dealt with Jesus’ adult life and his public ministry.
Alessandro Speciale, Vatican correspondent for the Religion News Service, told CNN the pope was not so much aiming to debunk myths as trying to show that the Jesus depicted in the Gospels is a real historical figure, who walked on earth and talked to people like anyone else.
The pope also looks at scholarly studies of the Bible, some of which have indicated for decades that the traditionally accepted birth date for Jesus is wrong, Speciale said.
But while the book points out that the Gospels do not support the presence of animals at Jesus’ birth — a detail apparently added in later centuries — the pope does not suggest they should be thrown out of the Nativity scene, Speciale said.
How do you feel about the book? Does it change your view of traditional Christmas beliefs?
Oh for pity’s sake, anyone whose Faith is shattered because they find out that the story of the very first Christmas isn’t absolutely and literally true has got serious serious problems.
Oh merciful heavens, what’s going to happen to these people when they find out there is no Tooth Fairy.
As for the accuracy of the date of the first Christmas, this is not anything that has been recently “suggested”. This has been known for a long time. The date chosen does not match historical records nor does it match what astronomers have known all along.
The date chosen is the Winter Solstice, or close to it, the darkest night of the year, the point at which the days start to grow longer and the sun returns. That date has had religious significance long before Jesus and is why it was chosen. The Christian Church, historically, has expanded its influence by adopting local religious customs, traditions, and practices, particularly the ones, like festivals, that were fun.
Why would that be a shock to anyone?
The idea that animals might naturally be hanging around a feed bin (manger) always seemed like one of the more credible parts of the tale to me. My horses seem to spend about 75% of their time there, either eating or waiting to be fed.
How many Wisemen came to visit the child?
My take on Xmas Myths: It doesn’t really matter what the Pope says to a large block of Americans. We live in a “godless” society fuled by Liberal propaganda void of any spiritual connections. Liberal backed Athiests will continue to attack any school, church, or government entity for the sake of their own warped ideology. The new God, or Tooth Fairy, is Uncle Sam promising endless “handouts”. When the dollar finally crashes and the goodies are gone the liberal masses will be screaming “Oh God….please help me”.
The number of three wisemen came about because of three gifts. Groups like that traveled in large numbers to protect against robbers. There could have been as many as 600 hundred who came from Babyalon. They saw in the stars that a king was born in Israel. The trip probably took two years. Heriod had all the babies five and under killed to be sure of good results. A miracle star appeared to the wisemen once they arrived in Jeruslaem to lead them to Bethlehem.
Since the entire Christmas story is a myth I’d say he has a lot more debunking to do.
No Angelina, that is the purpose of the Popes message. That while myths surrounding the birth of Christ abound, the birth of Christ is a very real event as is the life and message of Christ.very real. The Popes message is the myths need to be addressed to focus on the much larger truth, Christ.
It’s the Three Gifts and the Three Magi (astrologers) because three and multiples thereof is a magic number. As is seven and multiples thereof. The Star of Bethlehem was most likely the triple conjunction of Jupiter and Saturn in Pisces (7BCE) which would have been seen as foretelling the birth of a king. There was no Slaughter of the Innocents. There is no record of such a thing happening. And there would have been. The Romans were really good at record keeping. Herod’s position as king of that region was shaky—he wasn’t Jewish—and heavily dependent on his keeping Roman favor. Rounding up babies and killing them would not have pleased the Romans. They had enough problems without that kind of brutality stirring up people who hated their guts already. Palestine/Israel was a political mess. People living there didn’t like being occupied by the Romans. The Messiah the Jews were waiting for was a leader who would drive the Romans out
Indications are that the nativity story as told in Matthew (written in Greek 80-90 AD) was rigged so as to be the fulfillment of an earlier prophecy.
And as far as I’m concerned anybody who gets upset with attempts to understand actual historical events in their actual historical context doesn’t have a whole lot of faith.
It’s not the literal facts that matter. It’s what the story means that matters
The is no God, Three Gifts, Three Magi, or Jesus. The new God in Iowa is an exploding debt of entitlements. Just a cheap bag of fairy tales. Big govenment is Lord Thy Jesus. Iowa is just like the Romans. Gotta Love it.
http://thegazette.com/2012/11/24/iowas-government-debt-reaches-all-time-high/
Knowing the precise year of Jesus’ birth is probably not important for people of faith. Neither is the presence of live stock or singing of angles. The important thing is that Jesus existed.
There also is no reason to politicize religion either.
Ellickson,
Knowing the exact year isn’t important. You’re right about that. But there’s a whole sequence of events in the story told by Matthew that affirms Jesus as the fullfillment of Old Testament prophesies. Upsetting that sequnce by pointing out the high probabllity that the story was constructed backwards—stringing together earlier events in such a way that they lead inevitably to the conclusion with which we start—probably would upset some people.
As for Jesus, whether he actually existed is irrelevant—there’s no good evidence that he did. That people believe he existed does matter.
Politicize religion? Now who would do that.
“As for Jesus, whether he actually existed is irrelevant—there’s no good evidence that he did”
At least your anti Christian bigotry is starting to make sense. Disputing settled history is the home of real demagogs
What “settled history” are you talking about and exactly how, where, and when was it settled ?
“Disputing settled history is the home of real demagogs [sic]”
Excuse me.Mr Williamson, did you really mean that? Did you really mean that we should take whatever we are fed and never ever no never ask any questions?
But at least your anti everyone who doesn’t accept Jesus Christ as their personal Savior is starting to make sense.
Roberta your lies and false accusations are wearing thin. I have never mentioned a thing about accepting Jesus. So prove that I did or all will assume you just lie out of habit.
That Christ walked the earth and preached is not questioned by a single historian.
” . . . not questioned by a single historian.” What is your source for that statement ? Who or what organization conducted a survey of historians ( there are probably hundreds of thousands of historians throughout the World — not a single one, complete agreement ? Unlikely ! ) ?
Sorry, Williamson, the only things known about Jesus with absolute certainty is that there was an individual whom we may assume was Jesus who was from Galilee, was baptised by John the Baptist and crucified by the Romans. The rest is hearsay and legend. A man named Jesus of Nazareth probably did exist. But Jesus Christ Son of God is the creation of his followers. Jesus Christ is no more historically real than is King Arthur or Lao Tzu.
But it doesn’t matter. Jesus Christ exists as a collection of teachings cobbled together by those who followed those teachings long after Jesus died. Whether or not Jesus actually said the things he is thought to have said or actually taught the things he is thought to have taught is irrelevant.
You either have faith that these things matter or you don’t. But if you are looking for Truth in facticity, you’re looking in all the wrong places
The Constitution gives Congress the duty to create money. you would have to be as uninformed as a conservative to say we will go broke when we can create our own money.
I don’t know what your comment has to do with the subject but “creating (printing) our own money” eventually leads to inflation with the end result being the money may be devalued to the point it becomes near worthless. ( A $1000/month pension may eventually only buy a loaf of bread. ) You can look to the history of some other countries to see examples of it.
Lecturing to the “uniformed” Dean? I’m quite sure that silver coin in Jesus’ time was worth far more than your inflated, soon to be, worthless dollars. LMAO
Did the Pope also say there was no Little Drummer Boy at the manger ? I hope so ! ( Maybe the song will be played less. )