Still nothing about the ten new polling places.
I think the City and the Gazette are purposely trying to create mass confusion on the voteing day to push this thru. I bet CREST and the rest of the yes voters KNOW where to vote

“Why didn’t you protect us? some asked of the city then, Vernon said.” Why did you live in 100 year flood plan for forty years? Help yourself citizen, take some responsibility for you and your own family.

Let cut through all the BS here.

DETERMINING THE PRICE!
The city’s public works director and city engineer, says the cost (estimate) of $375 million for the city’s (preferred plan)..
THE ARMY CORPS’ ROLE
The Corps’ rules require it to support only flood protection that protects an amount of property value at least equal to the cost to provide the protection. As a result, the Corps’ benefit-cost ratio allowed it to recommend just a partial east-side protection system for the city. The plan now has been forwarded to Congress.
No approval design or pre-construction for the West Side, and the City rejected the CORP original design for East side flood protection that represented a significantly savings to tax payers..
The cost ratio states it is Cheaper to move people out of harms way than it is to build a flood wall on the East side. So why are tax payers expected to pay for a Flood wall that was not justified. More entitlements! The buy out program provided the opportunity for people to move out of harms way..
They had FEMA recovery funds, Tax free living for a year, Red Cross living expenses, HUD Forgivable loans NOT ENOUGH! You want the Tax payers to provide a Flood wall that is rejected by the Federal Government.
When can we expect people to stand up and fight their own burdens, and not share their love of the City with Tax payers?
VOTE NO!

The final bit of that story should leave little doubt as to how clueless the We Can Do Better CR folks are.

Let’s be clear here, the guy quoted is in a house that is IN THE FLOOD PLAIN… he doesn’t like this plan because in order to not live in the flood plain, his house has to go. So instead they offer a bunch of random “plans” that aren’t going to be approved by the federal government, from dubious sources, in turn setting up a situation that will cost this city more money in the long run.

and DREDGING!?!? The Corp found that dredging the River would cost $90-100 million (roughly what a 5 year LOST Extension would bring in) and would reduce the 2008 flood by 5 freaking percent! So the entire LOST would be used up (assuming the Corp even lets you dredge, which I highly doubt), the Federal Government would not have participated in the farce, and will still be planning for east side protection.

these are the “alternatives” these buffoons constantly offer, they aren’t alternatives, they are completely un-vetted plans made by people who don’t have a clue what they are talking about which will cost the taxpayers of this city far more in the long run.

If you think the city should just abandon the west side, well, that’s your right, I think it’s misguided and horrible for this community, but so be it, vote no.

If you actually want communities like Time Check to come back, and want to ensure that nobody is living in a flood plain, then vote yes. THIS is how it gets done, voting no means doing nothing, there will still be hundreds of homes that were flooded in 2008 that won’t have flood protection, that what a no vote guarantees.

Again, Tuesday’s vote has little/nothing to do with the east side, this is a vote on an alternative for the West Side besides having a mile wide swath of town that is abandoned, with a few stubborn holdouts that the city will still have to provide sewer, water, and roads to at an inflated cost to taxpayers.

Don’t forget to add at least another 50 million to the cost of the west side flood wall. If it where built, the time it takes to get started, built, and finished cost will have risen due to mostly oil prices. We don’t need a LOST to build the west side wall. I have been told by our city leaders that the city will be making lots of money once the new convention center opens in 2 years. We can use that money plus the traffic camera money to fund the west side wall.

Add $11 million+ to protect Mays Island, as promised to the Linn Co. Supervisors last year.

So now we have a plan again. Questions on the preferred plan: How do you explain to residents of Rompot that they are not protected and I would still like an explanation of the new dam shown downtown by 12th Ave I believe. How much was paid to SASKI to design this and will their plans be used or scrapped and some other consultant will get millions of our tax dollars to re-design, which means this isn’t the plan after all. This is getting so confusing when it changes daily from a concept to a plan, to a concept, to a plan. Talk about disorganization!
I would think the WeAreBetter group is fairly organized if they could beat the 1/2 million dollar corporate campaign last May with a few thousand dollars. They at least debated the issue last year. As far as “alternatives” the city has always maintained the “my way or the highway” attitude, which is very arrogant. At least this group is trying to engage with the reality of the current economic situation on all levels of public funding. Personal responsibility is another aspect of their alternatives, not just whining that they invested in multi-million projects (with our money by the way) and only NOW are concerned about protecting it.

IN A CHILD’S EYE:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4nHpqkd34M&feature=related

What kind of CR do we want to leave to our children and grandchildren? What kind of example do we want to set? One where people come together and work for the common good of making CR a better place? Or, One where their future wasn’t important enough for us to care?

Anyone notice the error in the map of the walls?

What is with all these people thinking this is a vote for protection on the west side? Lets look at the numbers.
The cost projections for the east side alone are $200 million. Now we know from recent experience with the cities so called experts these estimates are probably low. As is evidenced with the hotel and convention center projects.
The corps has said they will pay $65 million, but the corps has a list of projects awaiting federal funding and Cedar Rapids is at the bottom. There is no idea when this funding will come.
The LOST tax is projected to bring in $180 million over 10 years.
In order to get LOST on the ballot the city had to promise to protect May’s island those cost projections are not included in the $200 million.

When you add it all up cost overruns, May’s island, lack of federal support we will be lucky if 10 years of tax covers the cost of protecting just the east side.
I would say it is more likely we won’t see federal funding in the next 10 years then it is likely.

That leaves us with $175 million projected cost to protect the west side. Looks like we might need another 10 year LOST after the first one is done….. Vote No March 6th

“Of course we have a plan,” she said. “It’s been posted on the city Web page for three years,” added Dave Elgin, the city’s public works director and city engineer.

“The plan is in constant use at City Hall and has played a central role in the city’s property buyout program”

” Plan critics have called the city’s plan a “Cadillac” one. Among the most vocal critics, 2005 City Council candidate Tim Pugh, has said the city’s plan comes with fancy streets, expensive parks and trails and leaves “large sections of the city unprotected.”

Elgin and City Council member Vernon say such criticism is incorrect.

Elgin said the preferred plan is “not an economy special and it’s not an extremely expensive plan with a lot of frills.” The plan does not include money for extras, though the plan will replace streets and trails in the way of the flood protection system, he said.”

By Rick Smith

“” The Gazette

Oct. 9–CEDAR RAPIDS — The city’s proposed system of levees and flood walls won’t arrive quickly, in part, because it will cost up to $1 billion to build, a consultant said Wednesday.

That money, by and large, will come from Congress.

At the soonest, it would take three to four years to begin the flood protection work and possibly another four to seven years to build, said consultant Jason Hellendrung, a principal with Sasaki Associates of Watertown, Mass. Completion of the project could take eight to 15 years, he said.

At a Wednesday morning news conference at the temporary City Hall, Hellendrung provided details of the City Council’s preferred system of future flood protection, which he unveiled at last Wednesday’s council meeting.

The public will get to see the proposal up close at two open houses on Oct. 16 at the U.S. Cellular Center. One is from 10 a.m. to 2 p.m.; the second is from 4 to 8 p.m.

Some details provided by Hellendrung of the proposed protection system are:

–The levee through the Time-Check Neighborhood will be two to two and a half blocks from the river and 600feet wide at some points.

–The levee in many places will be 12 feet to 17 feet tall, but in some spots it will gradually climb from the river so itwon’t seem so tall.

–The system of removable flood walls planned for the east side of the river in the downtown and for the Czech Village commercial district will include a permanent wall not significantly higher than the wall now in place in the downtown. Pillars will hold 9 — to 12-foot-high panels put in place at times of flooding. “”

The attempt to confuse, say this, say that, not mean that but this. Is astounding to say the least.

Where did the plan come from?

Amazing, not one mention of SASAKI
http://www.sasaki.com/

The summary of estimated costs from Stanley Consultants are from 12/04/2009. They are now 2 years and 3 months old. Is that still the same price? Doubtful. Food, gas, and insurance as well as just about everything has gone up a few percentage points since that plan was priced.

That given and the fact that these projects historically run 25% to 30% (or more)over budget (hotel and convention center project is already 30% over budget and climbing) we are looking at $468.7 million to $487.5 million at a minimum.

None of the entities that will be hired to work on any piece of this project (design, utilities, surface restoration, etc.) are going to do it for what it was “priced” at over two years ago.

We are fooling ourselves if we think this “Preferred Plan” will cost less than $500 million.

Can one really retract their passion?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUj4E-cKqVE&feature=related

My husband and I both received two notices about where to vote. I’m voting yes on Tuesday. We need protection on both sides of the river. Local match is needed to get funding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OyZwL9PbRgI these flood impacted people are not asking for your tax money. Vote no!

Ajai,
If the East side protection gets built and the West side doesn’t, and the water level on the West could easily be increased by 3 ft., do you really think these people would care to do without flood protection?

Facts about a sales Tax!!!
It is the most unfair tax that can be placed on a population. It is regressive and particularly hard on the poor. Do we as a community really want to protect millionaire downtown property owners or those who’s biz does not charge their customers a sales tax and also those same downtowners from having to pay for flood insurance or their own flood wall with a regressive tax that will be extracted from the labors of the poor. As a city do we really want to give an incentive to people moving too or those currently living in Cedar Rapids looking for a new residence to move to Hiawatha, Marion, Robins or Fairfax where they will have $100′s of millions extra to spend on streets and other public services that they will not have if they choose to live in Cedar Rapids. Do we want to tell those currently living in Marion, Hiawatha, Robins and Fairfax to not shop in Cedar Rapids and stay in their own towns as that will provide them better public services. And how long is it before those downtown business people figure out that they can buy home building materials and other big ticket items outside of this community and have their efforts paid for by the sales tax savings. . And the list goes on. Using a sales tax to pay for the flood protection is really a bad plan for most of us. What ever happened to things like believing in and promoting personal responsibility. It’s obvious that Crest, the city council and the down town biz’s and property owners don’t believe in this cherished principle and instead want the rest of us to be personally responsible for one of the expenses they ought to pay for in the operation of their rental property’s and down town biz’s in Cedar Rapids.

Steve,

Agreed! Unfair to burden all, for a few feeling entitled.
I suggest everyone entertain the idea of internet shopping.
Don’t trust credit card ordering online?
Now it’s the lesser of the two evils.
Spread the Love for the Internet. Free Shipping, No City tax……

Conspiracy Theories and How Many are There
The real conspiracy is centered around creating the appearance of conspiracies by the “No” campaign commenters, and leadership as they use a political ploy to cast last minute shadows and doubts to persuade undecided voters to vote “no” or to not vote at all. This is a response to various comments in Gazette articles.

1. The conspiracy of declining a debate – At the first of January the editor of the Free Press (Ajai Dittmar) and one head opposition leader (Greg Vail) were informed that CREST was not going to set up a debate, but they were going to do mailings and phone calls to voters, which did not involve tax payers money, but used donations and volunteers. CREST members were later asked to join in a debate (Feb. 24, about one and a half months later), but declined, since it had no intent to do a debate, so why ask them to do something they were not inclined to do. This invitation to a debate was part of a design to create the look of deception on the part of CREST, as a last effort on the part of “no” opposition to cast a shadow of doubt in the voters’ minds right before the vote. I was the one that spoke to Greg and Ajai, at their home. Regarding the debate and the city council, what they do and why is their business.

2. CREST has been secretive and misleading – Since the beginning of the CREST Committee it has reached out to community members from all areas and walks of life in the city. It did the publicly noticeable petition drive and it set up a website, which some opposition have visited it. CREST responded to an article in the Free Press. Some of the CREST Committee members had direct contact with various opposition members from the very beginning. CREST has filed financial reports that are publicly accessible.

3. The City, CREST and the Gazette have changed the polling places to stop people from knowing where to vote – The city redistricting had nothing to do with CREST or any input from them. The City, CREST and the Gazette have independently listed new polling information from Linn County to assist the voters. CREST is making the effort to have people at the old polling areas to help direct voters to the correct polling areas (assistance to yes and no voters). CREST has been informing people, if they took the time to listen to the phone contacts, that there were new polling locations according to information provided by Linn County. CREST is self-governing and acts independently of the council or the Gazette.

4. There is no plan for the west side flood protection – Whether called “concept”, “initial” or “the preferred plan” or whatever, there has been a plan since 2008 and public input along the way. There have been estimates for the cost and a number of design possibilities or options. Everything starts somewhere and plans can change according to needs. Any that want to deny there is a plan is doing so to create an air of deception.

5. The HUD Audit Report and “misspent” money listed by Robert Cooper in several of his comments – HUD audits are part of their oversight measures and designed to catch errors, misinterpretation, and to insure corrective measures are taken. There where corrections and additional measures taken in all of the Jumpstart programs (home owners, landlords and business programs). Read the audit reports entirely to get a better understand of what transpired in the state’s comments and actions. Audits and reporting are part of any federal, state and local grant/funding programs, as oversight measures. I encourage people to read the entire HUD Audit report, so they can better understand what it is: http://www.hudoig.gov/pdf/AuditReports/IA/ig1071001.pdf

Crest, the city council, the gazette and it’s reporters could have showed those no people and accepted a debate. If your program is not about getting the right thing done and is more about selling people on a cortrolled set of facts that you believe is important then you go about the process just as Crest, the gazette and it’s reporters, the city council and the chamber went about it. If this turns into a no majority vote you yes people have no one to blame but yourselves. Some times people can’t be trusted, because they really can’t be trusted.

Vote YES on Tuesday! Protection for BOTH sides of the river and a stronger future for our city!

Voting Yes will never protect the west side.

You can’t put up 2 walls and increase a flood by 3 feet at the Nuclear Power plant to the north.

Its a sham

VOTE NO

Why, throughout this highly strained process, has the preferred plan become the holy grail? It is very difficult to believe that this particular approach is the only way to provide flood mitigation, yet we are asked to fund this one plan. Why isn’t this vote being held to approve one of several options to alleviate potential future disasters? It would make sense to first pursue some options, consider their relative merits and costs, and let the taxpayers make the best choice.

Instead, since the Army Corps is firm that protecting the west side is not cost effective, we are given one plan tainted with the tired west side/east side paradigm this city has labored with for decades. Let’s face it folks, if we protect the ‘east side’ we are really protecting downtown while leaving our fellow citizens in Rompot to their eventual doom. If we protect the west side it comes out of our pockets to protect residential areas that could really be re-located to high ground with less expense. It’s a huge project either way and the only option we’re given is an up or down vote on one plan. The Mayor/ Council are essentially dictating this way or the highway. Period.

There have been questionable, at the least, uses of LOST revenue already, and the funds have already been misappropriated through sleight of hand i.e. shifting LOST tax collected from Alliant Energy to the general fund. The Council has ignored its advisory committee for fund usage making it plain that the committee was mere window dressing to sell the sham of community input.

There is no guarantee of State or Federal funds coming through. Much is made of a 50-0 vote in the Legislature to approve flood mitigating funds, but that’s only one side of the aisle in Des Moines and even if approved by the full body we would still be in a long queue with other state wide needs. How’d things go with the Missouri River last year? Don’t you think those folks have legitimate need of State help? And, anyone who thinks getting Federal funds appropriated for OUR needs is a done deal doesn’t pay much attention to the condition of the Federal coffers these days or more recent disasters the Feds must address. Anyone who thinks this tax will be removed if State or Federal funds do not come to fruition is just simply foolish. It will not be removed.

We’ve voted this down once and were promptly brought to a vote on the same ‘plan’ and the same funding vehicle. Removing street repair and halving the tax sunset is no more than cheap window dressing. No consideration was ever given to exploring more creative options and backing the vote up to the general election in November thus saving $80,000, providing time to consider options, and having a much more legitimate vote due to higher turnout. And if anyone thinks CREST is a grassroots organization they need to look at their contributors. Fact is CREST is funded by mighty oaks not grass roots and it’s an insult to us all to suggest otherwise.

If one considers that the sole issue is still the one ‘preferred plan‘, that LOST funds have already been misused, that there is no guarantee of ever getting the matching funds, that oversight committees have been ignored, and that the numbers (projected revenue collected and projected project costs) are constantly shifting it becomes obvious that this Mayor/Council is interested in taking in revenue far and away more than ‘protecting the west side’. They essentially have their downtown interests protected, while ignoring Rompot, and it is difficult to take at face value that they give a damn about the west side at all. They want revenue and, once in place, will maneuver its use as they see fit. That has been their history.

Any voter might also consider the following scenario. Those who were here please take a moment to consider what the city looked like at the flood’s height, put the terrible picture in your minds eye for just a moment… Now picture the current river inside its bank; consider the width from bank to bank through town, especially downtown. Finally imagine the amount of water involved at the water’s high level choked into the current bank and imagine the result upstream. There is no way the result would not be far more devastating to Palo and who knows how far above Palo. How much more farmland would be ruined (at least for the season). Do we have the right to do that to others? You can choke that river to protect a (relatively) small area, but the water will still be there, it will still flow and it will not stop. The only result will be for it to spread out upstream.

This vote is not about the grossly simplistic “to protect the west side” There is far more at stake. We can, and should, do better. Please be responsible.

VOTE NO!

Many people have commented and some have said we should just leave the area undeveloped. Some have said the people who lived there shouldn’t have received a dime in assistance and others have said they flood victims were greedy and took free money from all over the place. It sounded so good I was thinking about buying another house and hoping for another flood so I could enjoy all those freebies again. I will just forget the 100 thousand dollars worth of personal property I lost including pictures of my grown children when they were just babies. Some have said that the people who still live there are horrible people because they don’t want the government taking their home away. I say and have said to Craig and Ajai and Greg since 2008 that they should be able to live anywhere they want as long as they are willing to accept the consequences. It appears to me they are not asking the voters to pay to protect their homes and in fact they are asking the voters to Vote No and leave them alone. It seems funny to me that the people who want the flood protection are not the people who lived there before the flood and in fact most of those people are gone. 1200 of those homes have been bought out and many have been demolished and empty lots are there instead. The people who actually support the tax extension seem to be the people who were given that land and those empty houses. They seem to be the people who are affiliated with Non-Profits who have raked in millions of dollars in public and private money. Those same people draw large salaries and I believe the reason they want the LOST extension is so they can continue to draw those salaries for years to come. Lets try to make sense of this whole thing. Lets see who really supports this and why? If certain members of CREST have been given free property does that not make you question their motivation? If corporations and perhaps developers have been given free land and 40k subsidies per house they build in the flood plain Is that not suspicious? If the government says there is not sufficient value on the west side to spend the money to protect it then Why is our city council allowing contractors to rebuild houses on the very same lots that were flooded in 2008? Does that not concern you? I am at a loss as to why our own government would allow our city council to use 10′s of millions of federal dollars to buy out flooded homes and millions more to demolish them and then allow the same council to give those lots away for free and then let the city council use a 12 million dollar federal grant to subsidize the developers with a free lot and a 40k cash subsidy per house. How stupid is that? Is that how you like to see your tax money spent? If the council says it is likely to flood again and if the same council says it will take years to plan and build flood protection Why are we building millions of new houses in harms way and using your tax dollars to subsidize them to boot? I say the backers of the LOST extension are the very people who will gain and those are not the flood victims of 2008. They are the new owners of that land and it was given to them for free. They had hoped to get the public to pay the cost to protect their newly acquired land that the council was kind enough to give them for free. Remember all It was your money that paid to buy out the flooded homes and it was your money who tore them down and it is your money that pays for the free lots and 40k subsidies and the only winners are the recipients of all your kindness. The flood victims are long gone and the ones that are still there don’t want your help or your pity.

Not millions of new homes of course I meant millions of dollars worth of new homes